Since it's a topic of discussion on various basketball forums I thought I'd share a gift link to the WAPO piece on Mulkey just published. I didn't read anything surprising really…She's currently the highest paid coach in women's college basketball but I've never been a fan, despite her "success" as a coach. At any rate, here's the piece: https://wapo.st/4ad4ATn
bearister
9:43a, 3/31/24
Cancel my subscription to the Resurrection
Send my credentials to the House of Detention
I got some friends inside
Send my credentials to the House of Detention
I got some friends inside
BearBint
10:02a, 3/31/24
In reply to CalWSportsFan
My--I think we're wading into Faulkner-Williams territory here (in the story, I mean). No further comment, because I don't want Coach Kim talking 'bout attorneys around me.CalWSportsFan said:
Since it's a topic of discussion on various basketball forums I thought I'd share a gift link to the WAPO piece on Mulkey just published. I didn't read anything surprising really…She's currently the highest paid coach in women's college basketball but I've never been a fan, despite her "success" as a coach. At any rate, here's the piece: https://wapo.st/4ad4ATn
"Don't get distracted, myself. Don't get distracted." Self-talk from a young relative
GameDay
2:37p, 3/31/24
Reading this adds some additional complexity to the whole business with our women's swim coach. Not to excuse what she was accused of (and found guilty of by the outside Law Firm), but it appears that Mulkey acts similarly - or even worse in some respects. Both coaches were big winners. One fired and one going strong.
The difference, I suppose, is the culture at Cal vs. at LSU?
The difference, I suppose, is the culture at Cal vs. at LSU?
mbBear
9:50a, 4/1/24
In reply to GameDay
No way I give McKeever any kind of pass....like if she was in Baton Rouge she would still have a job??!
No. Way
GameDay said:
Reading this adds some additional complexity to the whole business with our women's swim coach. Not to excuse what she was accused of (and found guilty of by the outside Law Firm), but it appears that Mulkey acts similarly - or even worse in some respects. Both coaches were big winners. One fired and one going strong.
The difference, I suppose, is the culture at Cal vs. at LSU?
No way I give McKeever any kind of pass....like if she was in Baton Rouge she would still have a job??!
No. Way
bearister
4:19p, 4/1/24
In an alternate universe:
Cancel my subscription to the Resurrection
Send my credentials to the House of Detention
I got some friends inside
Send my credentials to the House of Detention
I got some friends inside
4:40p, 4/1/24
Yeah, not trying to give her a pass. (Hence my saying "Not to excuse what she was accused of...") I just find it interesting that there seemed to be SOME similarities - both apparently manipulated and verbally abused players as way to "motivate", both accused of discriminatory conduct (race for McKeever; gender for Mulkey), etc. But at least based on an absence of discussion in the long Post article, no one seems to be calling for Mulkey's dismissal. Just musing about a possible explanation for the different outcomes. I find the power dynamics interesting, especially since (as I recall), McKeever's argument in her lawsuit is NOT that she was only doing what other successful women's coaching did, but instead is that she as a female coach was treated differently than if she had been a male coach.
Anyway, not trying to start any arguments.
Anyway, not trying to start any arguments.
bearister
4:47p, 4/1/24
In reply to GameDay
Hey if you don't want to play for a Negative Reinforcement coach then don't play for that program.
As long as a coach like that wins, and doesn't get the school sued, they have lifetime employment.
As long as a coach like that wins, and doesn't get the school sued, they have lifetime employment.
Cancel my subscription to the Resurrection
Send my credentials to the House of Detention
I got some friends inside
Send my credentials to the House of Detention
I got some friends inside
ClayK
7:46a, 4/2/24
Just a note: Most of her players like Kim Mulkey. Brittney Griner has never said anything bad about her.
CalWSportsFan
8:19a, 4/3/24
Now to the the theater of the truly absurd....Louisiana governor's performative political stunt.... https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2024/apr/02/kim-mulkey-woke-lousiana-governor-anthem
"Louisiana's Republican governor has called for the scholarships of college athletes who are not present for the national anthem before games to be revoked. His announcement came after the LSU women's basketball team were absent during the pre-game ceremonies on Monday night ahead of their eagerly anticipated NCAA Tournament contest with Iowa.
Jeff Landry, the former state attorney general backed by Donald Trump whose victory in October's gubernatorial primary denoted a hard-right shift in Louisiana's politics, took to social media on Tuesday to criticize the Tigers and their head coach, Kim Mulkey, for not being on the court when the Star-Spangled Banner was played."
Mulkey said the anthem was played 12 minutes prior to game time when the team was prepping in locker room...no different than usual....just truly silly all around.
He should be careful. Mulkey might just take her game to Tennessee where I hear there's a head coaching job available....
"Louisiana's Republican governor has called for the scholarships of college athletes who are not present for the national anthem before games to be revoked. His announcement came after the LSU women's basketball team were absent during the pre-game ceremonies on Monday night ahead of their eagerly anticipated NCAA Tournament contest with Iowa.
Jeff Landry, the former state attorney general backed by Donald Trump whose victory in October's gubernatorial primary denoted a hard-right shift in Louisiana's politics, took to social media on Tuesday to criticize the Tigers and their head coach, Kim Mulkey, for not being on the court when the Star-Spangled Banner was played."
Mulkey said the anthem was played 12 minutes prior to game time when the team was prepping in locker room...no different than usual....just truly silly all around.
He should be careful. Mulkey might just take her game to Tennessee where I hear there's a head coaching job available....
annarborbear
9:00a, 4/3/24
I served in the military and still respect the National Anthem. I am obsolete.
SFCALBear72
9:22a, 4/3/24
We played a few teams this season at Haas who left the court before the Cal Band played our National Anthem.
CalWSportsFan
10:16a, 4/3/24
In reply to annarborbear
Well i don't think it's "disrespect" to be in the locker room prior to a game. When a team comes to the court can differ for various reasons… There were numerous times other teams weren't on the court before the game when anthem played at Haas. Frankly I'd prefer "America the Beautiful"
as the anthem-but regardless, this is just silly. I'd imagine the governor should have real issues on his mind. I'm sure Louisiana has a few?
as the anthem-but regardless, this is just silly. I'd imagine the governor should have real issues on his mind. I'm sure Louisiana has a few?
TomBear
4:30p, 4/3/24
I appreciate the intent from the Governor. Not sure this is the way to go about bringing some class back to athletics. But I'd have to give some thought to a reasonable approach.
BearBint
5:24a, 4/4/24
I don't see why any public university should require a public display of religion and/or patriotism at a sports event (but realize that many people disagree with me).
"Don't get distracted, myself. Don't get distracted." Self-talk from a young relative
wifeisafurd
9:26a, 4/4/24
In reply to mbBear
Mulkey would not be my cup of tea if my daughter was being recruited by her, but if you look at some of the long running (i.e., older) top coaches in women's basketball, they have strong personalities. Geno apparently has mellowed, but he wasn't exactly kind and gentle with his players. And UConn through Chris Daily have always dictated what UConn players wear, say and do. Notice players don't even discuss dating or sexual orientation until they graduate, and one well known player even kept being raped by a relative under wraps until after graduation. VanDerveer is very classy and has a wicked sense of humor with alums, but is a cold fish with players.
College team sports played at a high level requires a lot of discipline and to some degree sacrifice. Negative Reinforcement in Coaching StylesAnna Maria Collegehttps://annamaria.edu Becca-Foti-Spring-2018 As this study suggests, like it or not, negative reinforcement and incentives from avoiding punishment, such as loss of playing time, can work, but again, it depends on the individual, which gets Into a whole discussion about team culture and differences between genders, as the study indicates. But what is clear is that McKeever's conduct, as presented in the investigator's report, was way more extreme than what is alleged against Mulkey. McKeever's team was in open rebellion against her, where as Mulkey's players seem to be quite close with her. I think McKeever would be gone at LSU as well. There is negative reinforcement, and then there is abusive behavior.
I suggest people go look at the investigator's report and what was alleged in the newspapers against McKeever versus the general stuff alleged against Mulkey here. I don't see Mulkey's conduct driving players to suicide, or her making racist remarks, or exhibiting the extreme conduct that was associated with McKeever. In fact the author of the article, perhaps with some prodding from the newspaper's attorneys seems to have gone out of his way to indicate her players like her, and to question some of the players saying things about Mulkey.mbBear said:GameDay said:
Reading this adds some additional complexity to the whole business with our women's swim coach. Not to excuse what she was accused of (and found guilty of by the outside Law Firm), but it appears that Mulkey acts similarly - or even worse in some respects. Both coaches were big winners. One fired and one going strong.
The difference, I suppose, is the culture at Cal vs. at LSU?
No way I give McKeever any kind of pass....like if she was in Baton Rouge she would still have a job??!
No. Way
Mulkey would not be my cup of tea if my daughter was being recruited by her, but if you look at some of the long running (i.e., older) top coaches in women's basketball, they have strong personalities. Geno apparently has mellowed, but he wasn't exactly kind and gentle with his players. And UConn through Chris Daily have always dictated what UConn players wear, say and do. Notice players don't even discuss dating or sexual orientation until they graduate, and one well known player even kept being raped by a relative under wraps until after graduation. VanDerveer is very classy and has a wicked sense of humor with alums, but is a cold fish with players.
College team sports played at a high level requires a lot of discipline and to some degree sacrifice. Negative Reinforcement in Coaching StylesAnna Maria Collegehttps://annamaria.edu Becca-Foti-Spring-2018 As this study suggests, like it or not, negative reinforcement and incentives from avoiding punishment, such as loss of playing time, can work, but again, it depends on the individual, which gets Into a whole discussion about team culture and differences between genders, as the study indicates. But what is clear is that McKeever's conduct, as presented in the investigator's report, was way more extreme than what is alleged against Mulkey. McKeever's team was in open rebellion against her, where as Mulkey's players seem to be quite close with her. I think McKeever would be gone at LSU as well. There is negative reinforcement, and then there is abusive behavior.
mbBear
12:29p, 4/4/24
In reply to wifeisafurd
Appreciate the elaboration here..thanks.wifeisafurd said:I suggest people go look at the investigator's report and what was alleged in the newspapers against McKeever versus the general stuff alleged against Mulkey here. I don't see Mulkey's conduct driving players to suicide, or her making racist remarks, or exhibiting the extreme conduct that was associated with McKeever. In fact the author of the article, perhaps with some prodding from the newspaper's attorneys seems to have gone out of his way to indicate her players like her, and to question some of the players saying things about Mulkey.mbBear said:GameDay said:
Reading this adds some additional complexity to the whole business with our women's swim coach. Not to excuse what she was accused of (and found guilty of by the outside Law Firm), but it appears that Mulkey acts similarly - or even worse in some respects. Both coaches were big winners. One fired and one going strong.
The difference, I suppose, is the culture at Cal vs. at LSU?
No way I give McKeever any kind of pass....like if she was in Baton Rouge she would still have a job??!
No. Way
Mulkey would not be my cup of tea if my daughter was being recruited by her, but if you look at some of the long running (i.e., older) top coaches in women's basketball, they have strong personalities. Geno apparently has mellowed, but he wasn't exactly kind and gentle with his players. And UConn through Chris Daily have always dictated what UConn players wear, say and do. Notice players don't even discuss dating or sexual orientation until they graduate, and one well known player even kept being raped by a relative under wraps until after graduation. VanDerveer is very classy and has a wicked sense of humor with alums, but is a cold fish with players.
College team sports played at a high level requires a lot of discipline and to some degree sacrifice. Negative Reinforcement in Coaching StylesAnna Maria Collegehttps://annamaria.edu Becca-Foti-Spring-2018 As this study suggests, like it or not, negative reinforcement and incentives from avoiding punishment, such as loss of playing time, can work, but again, it depends on the individual, which gets Into a whole discussion about team culture and differences between genders, as the study indicates. But what is clear is that McKeever's conduct, as presented in the investigator's report, was way more extreme than what is alleged against Mulkey. McKeever's team was in open rebellion against her, where as Mulkey's players seem to be quite close with her. I think McKeever would be gone at LSU as well. There is negative reinforcement, and then there is abusive behavior.
mbBear
12:30p, 4/4/24
In reply to BearBint
I would not be among those who disagree.BearBint said:
I don't see why any public university should require a public display of religion and/or patriotism at a sports event (but realize that many people disagree with me).
mbBear
12:35p, 4/4/24
In reply to GameDay
That's fair, and no argument intended. For me, McKeever crossed the line of allowing any kind of conversation that involves her on par with any coach. That's just me...GameDay said:
Yeah, not trying to give her a pass. (Hence my saying "Not to excuse what she was accused of...") I just find it interesting that there seemed to be SOME similarities - both apparently manipulated and verbally abused players as way to "motivate", both accused of discriminatory conduct (race for McKeever; gender for Mulkey), etc. But at least based on an absence of discussion in the long Post article, no one seems to be calling for Mulkey's dismissal. Just musing about a possible explanation for the different outcomes. I find the power dynamics interesting, especially since (as I recall), McKeever's argument in her lawsuit is NOT that she was only doing what other successful women's coaching did, but instead is that she as a female coach was treated differently than if she had been a male coach.
Anyway, not trying to start any arguments.
SFCALBear72
2:31p, 4/4/24
I guess LSU point guard, Hailey Van Lith, has had enough. She entered the transfer portal today.
She's from Washington. Would she want to play in the ACC again with Cal? She was there before with Louisville.
She's from Washington. Would she want to play in the ACC again with Cal? She was there before with Louisville.
gljone
8:33p, 4/5/24
Wasn't she the coach at Baylor when they canceled a game in Berkeley because of bad weather? This was some time ago...and if I recall, Cal had a very good team that season...and at the time, I thought it was kind of cheap.